Jason

Christian Ex-Gay Ministry

Studien

Gen-Faktoren?

Eine Nachricht macht zur Zeit die Runde: amerikanische Forscher hätten angeblich Gen-Faktoren entdeckt, die die männliche Sexualität mitbestimmen. Bestimmte Variationen traten bei homosexuellen Männern öfter auf als bei heterosexuellen (nachzulesen in der Zeitschrift "Human Genetics").

Und schon jubelt die schwule Welt. Emails werden an uns geschickt mit Kommentaren wie: "Wissenschaft statt Wunschdenken!"

Es bleibt die Frage, warum man hier eigentlich jubelt und ob das wirklich Sinn macht.

JASON hat von Anfang an darauf hingewiesen, dass die Ursachen von Homosexualität für einen Christen zwar wichtig, aber zweitrangig sind. Einige Punkte, die man in diesem Zusammenhang beachten sollte:

1) Wenn Gen-Faktoren männliche Sexualität mitbestimmen, heißt das nicht zwangsweise, dass man "homosexuell" geboren wird. Sexualität ist auf ein Bündel von Faktoren zurückzuführen, von denen Genetik nur ein Teil ist. Was ist mit dem Teil, der nicht von "genetischen Faktoren" bestimmt wird?

2) Und selbst wenn dem so wäre - selbst wenn es ein "schwules Gen" gäbe: zum einen sind wir nicht willenlose Sklaven eines Gencodes (was für eine Vorstellung!), zum anderen ist ein "Gen-Faktor, der Sexualität mitbestimmt" nicht gleichzusetzen mit moralisch richtigem Verhalten. Wir wollen an dieser Stelle nicht darauf hinweisen, was sonst noch alles genetische (Mit-)Ursachen haben mag. Wird etwas dadurch richtig, dass es von "genetischen Faktoren" "mitverursacht" wird?

3) Für uns als Christinnen und Christen heißt das einfach nur, wir müssen und werden auch in einem solchen Fall lernen, damit zu leben. Für uns bleibt auch weiterhin die Bibel - Gottes Wort - Maßstab unseres Verhaltens und unserer moralischen Grundwerte. Wir zwingen dies niemandem auf und denken nicht, dass wir damit bessere Menschen sind. Wir sind es durchaus gewohnt, deshalb verlacht und verspottet zu werden. Letztlich ist uns aber wichtiger, dass wir unserem Glauben treu bleiben. Wir verneigen uns in tiefem Respekt vor allen Menschen, die trotz aller Schwierigkeiten und Anfeindungen diesen Weg mit uns gehen.

Ältere Brüder?

Eine weitere Untersuchung, die zur Zeit die Runde macht: der kanadische Psychologe Anthony Bogaert hat 1.000 homo- und heterosexuelle Männer untersucht und ist zu dem Ergebnis gekommen, dass mit der Anzahl älterer leiblicher Brüder die Wahrscheinlichkeit eines Jungen steigt, homosexuell zu werden. Für Bogaert ein klarer Hinweis dafür, dass durch eine Immunreaktion im Mutterleib das Gehirn des Babys bereits dementsprechend beeinflusst wird.

Auch hier dürfen wir auf unsere Ausführungen zum Thema "Gen-Faktoren" verweisen. Wir sind keine Wissenschaftler und maßen uns nicht an, derartige Studien zu beurteilen (wir wundern uns oft nur, wie kritiklos Studien akzeptiert werden, wenn sie nur mit den eigenen Vorstellungen übereinstimmen).

Selbst wenn Herr Bogaert zu 100 % recht hätte, wäre das für uns kein Grund, von unseren moralischen Werten abzuweichen. Unser Glaube bedeutet uns mehr als Ergebnisse von irgendwelchen Studien. Wir sind keine Maschinen oder Roboter, die willenlos Hormonen, Genen, Gehirnstrukturen oder was auch immer ausgesetzt sind. Wir glauben an den dreifaltigen Gott und das, was Er uns in der Bibel mitteilt.

Jesus hat uns nie versprochen, dass es leicht sein würde. Er hatte nur gemeint, dass es sich lohnen wird. Er hat uns darauf hingewiesen, dass das Tor zum Himmel eng, der Weg dorthin schwer und voller Gefahren sein wird und nur wenige ihn gehen. Für uns ist es aber der EINZIGE Weg.

Nur mal so am Rande: gehen wir doch einmal - nur so,  der Diskussion willen - davon aus, dass die Bibel doch recht hat. Was dann?


New research on same-sex households reveals kids do best with mom and dad(2015)

Posted by We can defend marriage on Dienstag, 1. März 2016

The Changeability of Adolescent Same-Sex Attraction

http://www.jonahweb.org/article.print.php?secId=294


Jonah Organization
  
The Changeability of Adolescent Same-Sex Attraction
 Written by Whitehead, Dr. Neil 
The Changeability of Adolescent Same-Sex Attraction
Written By: Dr. N.E. Whitehead, Lower Hutt, New Zealand

 


(Posted September 2010)

 


There is substantial literature that the sexual orientation of adolescents is notoriously unstable, and this has been known since at the least the time of Kinsey. It is one of the basic facts that most people in this field know.

 

Kinsey (Pomeroy, 1972) found about 2% of his sample although homosexual at one time had made a “satisfactory heterosexual adjustment”. The degree of change in this varied. This should be compared with modern estimates that 2-3% of the population is gay or bisexual, which is the standard estimate, based mainly on about 30 surveys from the ‘90s. This means a substantial fraction experience changes of various sorts. Kinsey found many of these changes were even as adults.

 

It was the standard psychological opinion even in the middle of the 20th century that adolescent sexuality was fluid, as shown by the following forthright comment from (Barnhouse, 1977)

 

"It is impossible for me to state strongly enough that to present this model to young people, or to allow them - as often happens in the contemporary climate of open discussion - to imagine that their transitory adolescent experiments are truly indicative of a settled homosexual disposition, is not only evidence of psychiatric ignorance, but is specifically wicked as well." (p153-154)

 

The work of  (Bell & Weinberg, 1978) showed very similarly to Kinsey that substantial numbers of  people made changes in orientation and approximately half of those initially thinking themselves homosexual declared themselves heterosexual as adult. There was also similar movement in the opposite direction, but only about 2% of those initially thinking themselves heterosexual changed to homosexual.

 

This essentially has become a rule of thumb in the field at least when considering adults. As given by Sandfort (Sandfort, 1997) and (Whitehead & Whitehead, 1999,2010) half of those initially thinking themselves homosexual become heterosexual when adult.

 

However work specifically on adolescent’s gives higher changeability.

 

The quoted work of Remafedi looked at 12 year-olds who would be expected to be even more unstable than adolescents. An estimate that 85% changed orientation, or perhaps more accurately attractions, is inherently reasonable.

 

The most detailed study to date is a very large longitudinal study by (Savin-Williams & Ream, 2007) who found changes in attraction so great even between ages 16 and 17 that they queried whether the concept of  sexual orientation had any meaning for those with same-sex attractions. In considerable contrast those with opposite sex attractions overwhelmingly retained them from year to year. From ages 17-21 those with some initial same sex attraction (this includes those with concurrent opposite-sex attraction) 75% changed to opposite sex attraction only. This is within error the same as the 85% figure which is the current object of debate.

 

The authors of the cited 85% calculation do not seem to have known of the existence of the 2007 study.

 

It can of course be queried whether adolescent attraction has any meaning at all, but the adolescents in these surveys certainly experienced them as real for them. But for the question “are they stable?” The conclusion from the above survey is that the answer is overwhelmingly yes for opposite sex attraction and overwhelmingly no for same sex attraction.

 

It is obviously a matter deserving serious consideration whether it makes sense to give permanent legal status to something so changeable. 

 

A survey of these and further related references is found in chapter 12 of My Genes Made Me Do It, which has been freely downloadable on the web () for many years. www.mygenes.co.nz

 

Reference List

 

1.    Barnhouse, R. T. (1977). Homosexuality: A Symbolic Confusion. New York: Seabury Press.

2.    Bell, A. P., & Weinberg, M. S. (1978). Homosexualities. A Study Of Diversity Among Men And Women. New York: Simon and Schuster.

3.    Pomeroy, W. B. (1972). Dr. Kinsey and the Institute for Sex Research. New York: Harper and Row.

4.    Sandfort, T. G. M. (1997). Sampling male homosexuality. J. Bancroft ((ed.)), Researching Sexual Behavior: Methodological Issues (pp. 261-275). Bloomington, Indiana.  Indiana University Press.

5.    Savin-Williams, R. C., & Ream, G. L. (2007). Prevalence and Stability of Sexual Orientation Components During Adolescence and Young Adulthood. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 36, 385-394.

6.    Whitehead, N. E., & Whitehead, B. K. (1999). My Genes Made Me Do It! Layfayette, Louisiana: Huntington House. 2nd edition (2010), available at .www.mygenes.co.nz 

Is Homosexuality Genetic?
Author / Contributor :: Dr. Neil Whitehead

Twin Studies: Is Homosexuality Genetic?

Written By: Dr. Neil Whitehead ( http://www.mygenes.co.nz/ ) (Posted January 2008)

E-mail: [email protected]

The answer to all the alleged biological influences is conclusions from - Twin Studies.

In this paper I describe a very simple form, which avoids many complications and gives us the information we need. Usually identical twins are compared with non-identical twins. In the case of SSA this has given very ambiguous results, but we find if we only consider identical twins, the situation becomes much clearer.

We compare whether both identical twins have a given trait. Identical twins have identical genes. And they usually have identical womb environment. And they have virtually identical upbringing. So if they both have the same trait, probably some combination of common genes, prenatal factors and upbringing is responsible. So the critical question is - if one twin has SSA, does the other twin? And in what percentage of cases?


Look carefully at the next figure:

Figure 8. Pairwise concordance among identical twins for 1 Lung Cancer, 2 Criminality, 3 Stroke, 4 Breast Cancer, 5 Same Sex Attraction, 6 Leukemia, 7 Malformation, 8 Alzheimer's, 9 Ulcerative Colitis, 10 Rheumatoid Arthritis, 11 Alcoholism, 12 Schizophrenia, 13 Depression, 14 Suicide attempt, 15 Diabetes type I, 16 Divorce, 17 Crohn's disease, 18 Asthma, 19 Hypertension, 20 Co twin is best friend, 21 Diabetes type II, 22 Autism, 23 Opposite Sex Attraction, 24 Phenylketonuria

The top point, #24 is phenylketonuria, caused by a known gene defect. If one twin has it, the other twin almost always has it. #23 is OSA. The concordance is very high. If one twin is OSA the other is usually OSA as well. However we cannot tell from this whether it is caused by genes, upbringing, or some combination. The concordances decrease as we move to the left, until we reach SSA which has a concordance of 11%. The other points with that kind of value are the cancers, which all oncologists will tell you have a large element of chance involved. SSA has a large element of chance in it. In fact we have to say it has an unusually large element of chance in it compared to most traits. By change we mean non-shared events, which affect one twin and not the other.

This 11% is a terribly important statistic. All the common biological and social influences known and unknown and yet to be discovered, add up to 11% concordance for men and 14% for women twins. All that long list of biological influences previously given in this paper are included, and they only add up to 11-14%.

Four papers agree that SSA pairwise concordance has about this value. One of them, a paper on adolescent twins found an SSA concordance of 7% for men and 5% for women, which is even lower but in the same ballpark. So we have to take it the figure is accurate and not going to change. If one twin has SSA the other usually does not.

There is one complication. People may say to you “I thought the concordance figure was 30%” or they may say “52%”. It is a fact that the early studies had higher figures but are also now universally acknowledged (and by their authors) to be highly biased samples. It is also a fact that they were quoting a concordance called “probandwise concordance” which is more complex than the “pairwise” concordance I quoted to you, significantly higher, and used in later calculations that do not immediately concern us in this paper. The only important conclusion is that whichever form is used, SSA would still be clustered among the traits with a very high chance component. The irony is that far from being a trait with extremely high degree of dictation by genes, it is almost as far from that as it is possible to get. This is another sad example of the public tending to believe the exact opposite of the truth in scientific matters SSA dictated? The exact opposite. I hope that from now on you will not be disturbed into thinking the genes or prenatal conditions are overwhelmingly important, regardless of what new discoveries may emerge.

Four years ago I spoke at the annual NARTH conference, and used the higher probandwise concordance figures. At that stage I was too conservative. I said the genetic effect was small. Now I would say “unusually smallâ€.

The gay activist may say to you – “Oh SSA is still dictated by the genes, but they are not exerting their effects – this is a known genetic phenomenon called poor penetrance”. The answer is that you have to have a known gene or genes producing the trait before you can say that, and in this case there are no genes. You might say to such a person “Please come back when a gene is found!

Now I want to clarify some points because there is significant risk of misunderstanding. I am not saying 11% of all twins have SSA – only about 2-3% do. I am not saying when a twin has SSA that in their case there is genetic influence and in other cases no genetic influences – all of us are subjected to all the genetic and social influences.

Why twins might differ

Now this analysis I am presenting shows that chance – non-shared experience - is an unusually large factor and accounts for differences between identical twins. What would be examples of this?


One twin sees internet SSA porn and the other doesn't
One twin misperceives the father favoring the co-twin
One twin is unlucky in (heterosexual) love and thinks he is gay
One twin is sexually abused and the other is not


Chance events, non-shared circumstances can lead to very different endpoints.


Now a disturbing factor for some at this conference may be to hear that not only are genetics a minor factor but family circumstances are also. While this is generally true for the vast majority, there is a small minority for whom the family circumstances are vitally important. But if one twin rebels against the masculinity expressed by his father or peers, the other usually does not. This is a chance occurrence, and as a generalisation parents are mostly not to blame for the SSA of their children. Accidental misperception of parental motives is much more common.

From Michael Brown: "A recent study from Australia confirms that homophobia is not the principle cause of gay...

Posted by Robert A. J. Gagnon on Donnerstag, 20. August 2015
The Guardian: Male sexual orientation influenced by genes, study shows

FOR IMMEDIATE NOTICE - We want to jump on this new hack article right away because we've been down the Xq28 road before and you know you will be brow beaten with these "facts" ad nauseum. For anyone literate - we've highlighted the laughable holes for you:

"A region of the X chromosome called Xq28 had some impact on men's sexual behaviour – though scientists have no idea which of the many genes in the region are involved, nor how many lie elsewhere in the genome.

Another stretch of DNA on chromosome 8 also played a role in male sexual orientation – though again the precise mechanism is unclear.

Researchers have "speculated" in the past that genes linked to homosexuality in men "may" have survived evolution because they happened to make women who carried them more fertile. This "may" be the case for genes in the Xq28 region, as the X chromosome is passed down to men exclusively from their mothers.

"The work has yet to be published..."

...he found that [only] 33 out of 40 gay brothers inherited similar genetic markers...

The gene or genes in the Xq28 region that influence sexual orientation have a limited and variable impact. Not all of the gay men in Bailey's study inherited the same Xq28 region. -->The genes were neither sufficient, nor necessary, to make any of the men gay.<--

The flawed thinking behind a genetic test for sexual orientation is clear from studies of twins, which show that the identical twin of a gay man, who carries an -->exact<-- replica of his brother's DNA, is more likely to be straight than gay. That means even a perfect genetic test that picked up every gene linked to sexual orientation would still be less effective than flipping a coin.

However, we don't know where these genetic factors are located in the genome.

"We found evidence for two sets [of genes] that affect whether a man is gay or straight. But it is not completely determinative; there are certainly other environmental factors involved." [Women must simply just be of some other species or don't have genes.]

13 February 2014

http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/feb/14/genes-influence-male-sexual-orientation-study

Bisexualität?

In der August-Ausgabe der Zeitschrift "Psychological Science" heißt es, dass kanadische Forscher in einer Studie mit 100 Freiwilligen herausgefunden hätten, dass Bisexualität eher geistig als körperlich sei. Männer reagierten nie gleichzeitig auf männliche und weibliche Reize. Auch würde die subjektive Wahrnehmung, was sexuell attraktiv sei, von der körperlichen Reaktion abweichen. Als Erklärungsmodelle gibt es verschiedene Theorien: viele bisexuelle Männer seien eigentlich Homosexuelle und würden nur aus einem äußeren Zwang durch die Gesellschaft heraus behaupten, sie seien bisexuell. Woanders heißt es, Bisexualität sei nur eine Art Übergangsphase zu Homo- oder Heterosexualität.

Nun habe ich selbst viele Jahre lang meine Homosexualität ausgelebt. Und auch ich habe - wie viele andere damals - immer die These vertreten, dass alle Männer eigentlich bisexuell wären, also "schwule Anteile" hätten (was o.g. Studie gerade widerlegt!). Das aber ohne wissenschaftlichen Hintergrund. Damals war das einfach nur Wunschdenken. Wir WOLLTEN, dass es so ist, denn dann wäre jeder Mann ein potentieller Wunschpartner.

Was mich betrifft, so hatte ich keine großen Hemmschwellen, ob jemand verheiratet war oder eine Familie hatte. Hauptsache, ich hatte Sex mit ihm. Im Grunde war es mir völlig egal. ob der nun homo-, bi- oder heterosexuell ist. Ganz im Gegenteil: in vielen Kontaktanzeigen wurden "Hetero-" oder "Bi-Typen" gesucht.

Soll man derartige wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen wirklich zur Grundlage seiner moralischen Werte machen? Aufgrund derartiger Studien von seinem Glauben abweichen?

Wohl kaum.